SGA number whatever: Sunday

[thegrrrl2002]

I have mixed feeling about this one. I wanted to be totally blown away by this ep, but somehow, I wasn't. Part of it was the lack of Sheppard/McKay interaction, which probably makes me a pathetic OTP slasher kind of girl, but it's one of those things that I've come to really enjoy about the show and I missed it here. The past few eps have spoiled me, focusing on their relationship. And now, here, we get nothing. It felt odd. Plus, it was very, very hard not to totally wince every time I heard the term 'exploding tumors'. I just couldn't get past that. Not that Stargate has ever been known for its spot-on science, but usually I'm good with the handwaving. Not so much this time. Just...no.

On the other hand, I really enjoyed Carson in this ep--it figures, I finally start warming up to character and they kill him off. I loved his interaction with all the characters, and he was so very warm and fuzzy and kind. But hey, leave the bomb disposing to the specialists! Darn you! Yes, I did get choked up at the end. Still, I wanted to see more comforting among the rest of the team. Some indication that they're there for each other, and supporting each other. And okay, yes, I'm hugely shallow--John in dress blues is a thing of beauty. And his sad, sad, wibbly face during the ceremony. Oh, John. The ending scene with Rodney and Carson's ghost was a nice touch. I hope in the following eps we get to see more of everyone's reaction.

Overall, I loved the glimpses of everyone's day to day lives. John teaching Ronon to golf was sweet and Ronon's "game" was a riot. And John asking Ronon if he had a girlfriend--or boyfriend, that was a nice touch. Then we get a huge slice of info on John: A failed marriage! Thank you, TPTB! Of course it didn't work, what with him being gay and all. Then there was Rodney and Katie, which made me a little sulky, even though the scenes were very sweet. Radek playing chess, Lorne painting (!), it was all very wonderful.

I was a little disappointed that we didn't get more interaction between Teyla and Elizabeth. I would love to see evidence of a growing friendship between them. Instead we get Elizabeth passing on a lunch with her in order to have lunch with Cute Guy. Even though I liked him, and like the thought of Elizabeth having a date, I would have rather have watched her and Teyla instead.

Any thoughts on who Teyla was talking about approaching in that first scene? I thought maybe Carson, or Lorne. I think we're supposed to think it's John, because of what Ronon said to John later, but I just don't get a shippy vibe between them. It may be the slash goggles I'm wearing. ::pushed them firmly up on nose::

I wonder if I'd have been more impressed with the ep if I hadn't been spoiled for it. Or if I was more fond of Carson as a character. Sorry to all the Carson fans out there--PM seems like a lovely, funny man, but the character never quite worked for me.

In the end...I don't know. I think I have to watch it again.

Comments

[tipsywitch.livejournal.com]

The Teyla thing - I think Carson - just coz of the way she reached for his hand when she was injured and not Johns.

I'm a Mcshep gal and I still cried at the end ( and not beacuse John and Rodney looked a purrdy dressed up... )

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Oh, good, point, she did reach out for his hand, didn't she? I thought that was very touching. And their scenes together have always been very warm.

I felt sad at the end because everyone else looked so heartbroken. I liked Elizabeth's speech, too. That worked for me.

[drlense.livejournal.com]

I said the same thing!

For a really great episode, I'm a little conflicted. I also think they would have done better losing Carson in a Wraith related-finale, rather than a random accident stand-alone episode.

I didn't mind the lack of Shep/McKay stuff- we've had so much of it lately, and it was nice to see them interacting with other characters. But that final scene was written for Hewlett and McGillion, and not Rodney and Carson. That kind of bugged me a bit.

[tipsywitch.livejournal.com]

Ahhh but...Has Carson ascended???

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

See, I'm spoiled, I want all McShep all the time. *g* Actually, I just wanted a few seconds of it, an acknowledgment of their friendship. It felt weird to watch an ep without them exchanging any words.

I think you're right about the ending--it was for the actors more than the characters. I've never gotten the impression that Rodney and Carson were great friends. Without my slash goggles on, I would think he's closer to Radek and John.

[cathexys.livejournal.com]

they would have done better losing Carson in a Wraith related-finale, rather than a random accident stand-alone episode. I was thinking about this all morning and decided I really, really liked that they didn't. I liked the fact that their lives are so much in peril that even a normal day can lead to death and that the danger is so random that it can happen in the middle of the city on the quietest of days. Somehow going into battle, fighting the Wraith, these are expected threats. But the thing about Atlantis is that it can always sneak up on them unexpectedly.... I kind of like that reminder a lot! There's a certain meaninglessness to the death (and I haven't seen anyone comment yet on whether Beckett's decision to operate was actually a smart one), and I like what that says about their lives...

grrrl, you might enjoy copracat's explanation (http://copracat.livejournal.com/331019.html?style=mine) of the exploding tumors. i laughed :-)

[sorchasilver.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen the episode yet but managed to spoil myself for it this morning completely by accident, and am surprised by how little I am upset by Carson dying. Maybe it's just that I still believe they will bring him back in some way in the future (given previous comments by cast and the production team), but I don't feel that bothered by it. I like the character well enough, but clearly not as much as I thought I did. Or I'm in denial/repressing/something.

Really hope they don't try to ram John/Teyla down our throats a la Jack/Sam, though. One of the things I really appreciated about SGA was the lack of that sort of thing, which always bugged me about SG1.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

The John & Teyla stuff was only hinted at, I didn't find it to be blatant. I think TPTB have sworn off overt shipping ever since SG1.*g*

[dvswraatins.livejournal.com]

Weird episode. It felt like the best episode ever and the worst.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up. I like that they took a chance with something different, but I dunno. Not sure if it worked.

[midnight-ink.livejournal.com]

I wanted to see more comforting among the rest of the team.

I'm going to be shameless for once (http://midnight-ink.livejournal.com/12216.html).

I also agree with tipsywitch: I think it maybe have been Carson Teyla saw, thus the desperate need to be there at his funeral.
Though, on the other hand ... didn't the messhall blow up? Or was it just a corridor? Because, if it was a (small, apart from the regular) messhall, then Teyla's love-interest would have been injured / killed as well, wouldn't he? Okay, even if it wasn't the messhall, she did see someone, and turned because of him, and the corridor blew up immediately afterward, so, it is possible that if it wasn't Carson, he is now either dead or injured.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Ah, I will check it out, thank you! *g*

I think it was the corridor that blew up, not the mess hall itself. But I'm not sure.

[lamardeuse.livejournal.com]

I cannot WAIT to get home and DL the big version (hope it'll be up by then). I have been spoiled MASSIVELY for this ep (hey, I was there while they were filming the John/Ronon game) and I've been vibrating for MONTHS. I'm kind of looking forward to it and kind of not, because I'm concerned about the direction of the show after this, but ah well, that's what fanfic is for. I'd hate to be a McBeck shipper right now, though. :P

[mmmchelle.livejournal.com]

I knew you were on the set. But *that's* what you got to see them filming? Damn.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

I remember your post! I was very intrigued. I can't wait to see the big version either, because John was all sorts of pretty in this.

[inthekeyofd.livejournal.com]

was totally like..WTF? JOHN WAS MARRIED!!

But how good was the boyfriend comment seeing that John has one??

I guess that Sunday's are the day of revelations.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

John having a failed marriage in his past seems to fit for some reason. Like being in Atlantis is the only thing he's ever succeeded at.

The boyfriend comment was cute.

[mmmchelle.livejournal.com]

The exploding tumors.

I can't believe I found it easier to handwave a science thing than you did. /g/

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Exploding. Tumors.

I just can't handwave. It's so wrong in so many ways.

How did the cast not crack up when they saw that?

[rustler.livejournal.com]

I feel pretty mixed about this one too -- maybe because I had such high hopes for the concept and it just...didn't quite get there. The Carson/McKay BFF scene felt more like a Paul/David scene to me as well. Which, well, okay, I'll give them a little sentimental leeway considering the circumstances, but it's really not borne out by anything we've actually seen on-screen for the past 3 years. I mean, McKay didn't ask Carson to give his eulogy!

I kind of feel bad that I don't feel worse about Carson's demise. I feel bad for the actor because he seems like a nice guy and now he's out of work, but the character just never made that much of an impact.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Yes, I was very intrigued by the concept, and like you, I think it sort of worked, but it sort of didn't. I liked that they took the chance, though. Break out of the mold a little.

McKay didn't ask Carson to give his eulogy!

Oooh, good point.

And I'm right with you on PM, he seems lovely and sweet and funny but I'm not really going to miss him all that much in the show. On the other hand, I really want to see the other characters missing him, badly.

[feather-autant.livejournal.com]

I loved how John looked a bit surprised when Ronon mentioned Teyla. like his mind didn't really go there. Yep, much more of a sibling vibe.

John is okay with the man/man thing. It's canon now! :D

Carson was always okay, nice side character for me, but this was the first time I really *liked* him. Bastards.

I missed John and Rodney interacting, too! I think it's because Rodney always felt golf was Rod's game, and even though he's been practicing his swing in private, it hasn't reached perfection yet, and he's waiting for that so he can stun John into lustful silence. *g*

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

John looked totally surprised when Ronon mentioned Teyla. Like it had never even occurred to him. And Teyla, well, if she were interested, maybe giving golf a try would have seemed a bit more appealing.

John was far more flirty with Ronon, I think. I loved when he whapped Ronon with the stick at the end of the scene. He's such a cranky loser.

I agree about the golfing. We needed Rodney there. *g* I know, a team golfing event! That would be hilarious.

[anitac588.livejournal.com]

The more I think of the way Carson died the more annoyed I am. I know, I know -- deaths do happen in RL, but if I compare Carson's death to the death of Peter Grodin, where it really played up to it -- sense of doom when they leave Grodin on the satellite and then the impact the news has on everyone on the Atlantis - perfect. This death has too much of Huh? aftertaste as Kolya's did. Also Exploding tumors?? Are you kidding? OK, let's not laugh, the man is dead.
I was surprised how much I liked Katie parts with Rodney, oh, only Rodney could go from an almost insult of her work to the marriage proposal. Also, Ronon rocked, big time.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Good point, Grodin's death was definitely done well. I wasn't annoyed by the manner of Carson's death that much, I like the idea that life is pretty damn fragile, but the setup was a little to melodramatic and manipulative. In a way that Grodin's wasn't.

Rodney was certainly very fun with his marriage proposal, even if it was to the wrong person. *g*

[clarkangel.livejournal.com]

I think you've come the closest to how I feel about this ep. Although, I didn't get even a bit weepy when Carson died. Being spoiled, maybe. Maybe it didn't HIT ME yet, like it hasn't hit JOhn. His scene at the end with Teyla, and him saying that, THAT was the best scene of the ep to me. Not in a shipper sense at all, but as a friends moment, being there for each other and Joe and Rachel nailed the emotions for me. That was the only spot that hit me emotionally.

I don't want Carson to go. He will live on in my fics cause he is the only Doc for me in SGA. He has to fix them up.

I did expect more McShep. I'm sorry, I realize Rodney has known Carson longer than Shep, but there's been very little in CANON to suggest Carson is the closest thing Rodney's ever had to a best friend. Canon HAS Shown that to be true of him and Shep. So that was way off to me.

I did love Carson in this. Great moments for him. So...Carson.

So..I didn't love or hate the ep. Just meh.

And as a Shep whumper, I'm really tired of Teyla getting whumped. Women whumped just don't do it for me. So PTB? FREAKING WHUMP SHEP ALREADY! :D

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

I did enjoy Carson a lot in this. I loved how sweet he was with Elizabeth, and then with Teyla.

And Sheppard's grief was fabulous, which sounds like a weird thing to play but JF played it so beautifully, and so in keeping with the character that it hurt just to watch him.

And Shep did get whumped in this ep...by Ronon. *g*

[thepouncer.livejournal.com]

I'm watching it for the second time now, and still mulling over what I think. There are so many moments that make me gleeful, and I think I'm okay with the way Carson died. The randomness of it does work - they face danger everywhere. I'd been pondering casting spoilers on the commute home, and not knowing anything other than "Carson leaving" I wondered if he mightn't have left/died/whatever in a confrontation with the Wraith, which would have been very poetic. But in this episode, he got to shine on multiple fronts - personal and professional - and I liked him again. I liked him in the beginning, but ever since he was made a regular, he bugged me. Too many episodes where he didn't really belong, a tendency to belittle Rodney in ways that demonstrated that Carson didn't have clue about team dynamics - but here he was lovely.

And John wore dress blues. I'm still in shock from that sight.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

Yes, yes, what you said about Carson. I really liked him here, and I haven't always enjoyed the character. I especially loved his gentleness with Elizabeth and with Teyla.

I have complicated feelings about the ep, too. It worked in some aspects, and in others, not quite so much. And I really would have enjoyed seeing John spend a little time with Rodney.

[fishbaum.livejournal.com]

My SO and I have been talking about this all day! I think Rodney came up with the whole "He was my best friend" bit out of guilt. Because yes, we've seen him and Sheppard doing tons of stuff together, and yet Carson seemed closer to Radek than Rodney. That was just Rodney's guilt.

And I, too, felt like the last scene was out of character, not that effective. Maybe, maybe it was hinting around with the whole concept that he's not dead-and-gone, just dead-for-a-moment or whatever. But the two scenes that felt sadder to me were the Ronon & Rodney one and the John & Teyla one.

And I, too, wonder where the heck the bagpipes have been all this time! And how come Carson's the only one who got a funeral? What about the two bomb disposal folks who died at the same time??

So, while parts of it were wonderful, the overall 'big shock' isn't really affecting me very much. Of course, I knew it was coming, knew about the whole "SaveCarsonBeckett.com" campaign, etc.

And yeah, Teyla's friend who blew up -- she had 'red shirt' written all over her! Ugh.

From the sublime to the ridiculous, all in 42 minutes. :) Great tv.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

I think Rodney came up with the whole "He was my best friend" bit out of guilt.

That's a thought. It just would have worked so much better if Rodney had just left out the 'best' part. ::sighs::

I could have done without the last scene, too. The funeral scene was very moving and well done, I thought. They should have just left it there. I assumed they had separate services for the bomb disposal folks, along with the other scientist.

[reginabellatrix.livejournal.com]

The past few eps have spoiled me, focusing on their relationship. And now, here, we get nothing. It felt odd.

It did, didn't it? All that time John and Rodney spend together and they don't see each other at all on their day off until a crisis hits? It just didn't ring true to me. (If John wanted to do the golf with his team thing, why didn't he invite Rodney? I'm sure Rodney would have jumped at the excuse not to go fishing.)


Any thoughts on who Teyla was talking about approaching in that first scene? I thought maybe Carson, or Lorne. I think we're supposed to think it's John, because of what Ronon said to John later, but I just don't get a shippy vibe between them.

I thought we were supposed to think it was Carson, given the hand-holding and Teyla's comment to John about how she felt about his death and needing to go to the memorial service on her own two feet. I don't really see that any more than I see John/Teyla (they have a sibling vibe to me), but it fits with the overall manipulative nature of the episode. (Poor Carson, denied both fishing and the love of a good woman before he died.)

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

All that time John and Rodney spend together and they don't see each other at all on their day off until a crisis hits?

Yes, exactly! They could have at least shown John attempting to get Rodney to come and play golf with him. ::sulks::

thought we were supposed to think it was Carson, given the hand-holding and Teyla's comment to John about how she felt about his death

Okay, yes, I thought so too. There's always been nice chemistry between them.

[duffy-99.livejournal.com]

The bad: I have an uncontrollable urge to shout out "exploding tumors" at random times in random places just to see what people will do. I can't get it out of my head. And believe you me, I want it out of there. I'm afraid I will open my mouth at a work meeting and "exploding tumors" will be what I say instead.

The good: Radek. Chess Hustling people out of cool stuff.

The really good: John. Uniform. I can now die happy.

The Very Good: Rodney. In every scene he was in.

[thegrrrl2002.livejournal.com]

LOL, yes, exploding tumors. ::headdesk:: It still doesn't sound any better a day later, does it? I think you should slip that into every day conversation. Just to see what happens. *g*

And I agree on all your points. Radek's hot chess skills, John's prettiness, and Rodney's wonderfulness. All of the good.